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Replies:
13
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Last Post:
Aug 7, 2006 11:02 AM
by: jeffv
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Posts:
27
From:
Paris, FRANCE
Registered:
8/2/06
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Question: Zones/Mpxio + Disk Array (HDS 9970V Lightning)
Posted:
Aug 4, 2006 5:25 AM
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Greetings people,
I was wondering if anyone here have some experience with mpxio and a storage array from a non-global zone?
Today we are using Veritas for doing all kinds of magic with both disks and the array but with the arrival of ZFS, Zones etc we are now looking into the possibilities of migrating a few servers into a 'bigger' server with ZFS and Zones.
What is the best way of installing a Zone? By sharing file systems as in 'sparse-root' model or use 'whole-root' model ?
As i understand things. Solaris 10 has mpxio sort of 'on' by default. Is this only for the Global Zone itself or can i 'disable' this and use it only for let's say 2 non-global zones?
What i need to accomplish/be sure of is,
1, Load balancing
2, Failover by using 2 paths to the array from 2 configured Zones.
3, ......
Regards,
Pierre
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Posts:
322
From:
GB
Registered:
1/18/06
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Re: Question: Zones/Mpxio + Disk Array (HDS 9970V Lightning)
Posted:
Aug 4, 2006 6:47 AM
in response to: frogman
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> Greetings people,
>
> I was wondering if anyone here have some experience
> with mpxio and a storage array from a non-global
> zone?
>
> Today we are using Veritas for doing all kinds of
> magic with both disks and the array but with the
> arrival of ZFS, Zones etc we are now looking into the
> possibilities of migrating a few servers into a
> 'bigger' server with ZFS and Zones.
>
> What is the best way of installing a Zone? By sharing
> file systems as in 'sparse-root' model or use
> 'whole-root' model ?
>
> As i understand things. Solaris 10 has mpxio sort of
> 'on' by default. Is this only for the Global Zone
> itself or can i 'disable' this and use it only for
> let's say 2 non-global zones?
Are the non-global zones going to share the 2 paths? Or do you have 4 paths (2 paths/zone)?
If you have only 2 paths it is pointless to try to to use mpxio at the zone level.
If you have 4 paths then you could assign a zfs pool per mpxio device, and assign the filesystem for each zone to the different pool. This would be sheer overkill. mpxio is at a very low level and presents the filesystem with 1 unified device. All fail-over and load balancing is done underneath this device, therefore both ZFS and zones need not worry about it. The sysadmin is the only person who needs to care :)
Making the switch from vertitas vm to mpxio/zfs is a smart move. I had made the switch in the past after I did some testing and found out that performance wise mpxio is better, and fail-over is instantaneous. Veritas had a much noteable delay (no io) while it worked out what happend... The price for mpxio also helps - FREE.
Doug
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Enda o'Connor -...
Enda.Oconnor@Sun.COM
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Re: Question: Zones/Mpxio + Disk Array (HDS 9970V
Lightning)
Posted:
Aug 4, 2006 7:44 AM
in response to: frogman
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Pierre Klovsjo wrote:
>Greetings people,
>
>I was wondering if anyone here have some experience with mpxio and a storage array from a non-global zone?
>
>Today we are using Veritas for doing all kinds of magic with both disks and the array but with the arrival of ZFS, Zones etc we are now looking into the possibilities of migrating a few servers into a 'bigger' server with ZFS and Zones.
>
If you can get away with it sparse root is most definitely better.
1 Less maintenance overhead ( shared filesystems between global and
non-global zones )
2 Less disk space consumed.
3 Lower memory useage, as the shared libraries are on shared file
system, they are only loaded once in memory for both global and
non-global zones. ( if you have a local copy of /usr/lib then all the
shared libs in /usr/lib taht you reference, will have to get loaded into
memory for the zone as well )
4 Tools such as patchadd/pkgadd etc all run slightly faster, ( not
having to install objects to filesystems that are shared )
In saying that, the answer kinda depends on what you are doing with the
non-global zones, if you are installing software that has to write to
/usr for instance then you are limited to having /usr writable at a minimum.
But if at all possible go with sparse-root zones.
Enda
>
>What is the best way of installing a Zone? By sharing file systems as in 'sparse-root' model or use 'whole-root' model ?
>
>As i understand things. Solaris 10 has mpxio sort of 'on' by default. Is this only for the Global Zone itself or can i 'disable' this and use it only for let's say 2 non-global zones?
>
>What i need to accomplish/be sure of is,
>1, Load balancing
>2, Failover by using 2 paths to the array from 2 configured Zones.
>3, ......
>
>Regards,
>
>Pierre
>
>
>This message posted from opensolaris.org
>_______________________________________________
>zones-discuss mailing list
>zones-discuss at opensolaris dot org
>
>
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Posts:
27
From:
Paris, FRANCE
Registered:
8/2/06
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Re: Question: Zones/Mpxio + Disk Array (HDS 9970V
Posted:
Aug 4, 2006 8:04 AM
in response to: Enda o'Connor -...
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Hello and thanks a lot for quick answers.
By looking at your answer it looks like we are going to go for spare-root model.
So, then to my second question which is actually something more of a design question i think...
1, I let's say i have my Main server running with a HBA card attached to a Disk Array (same as mentioned in my earlier question). I create and mount a nice disk 'pool' with ZFS and everything is working perfect.
2, I now create ZONE1. I would then like to mount a /export/home/ftp area on the Disk Array to use as well. Now, What is controlling my access to the HBA card and Disk Array from my Non-Global zone? How do i see my newly created /dev/dsk/... on the Array? Do i have to install the same driver into the non-global zone as i did to the Server itself or?
I hope i have succeded in making some sense here since this is bugging me and my Manager a little now.
Regards,
Pierre
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Posts:
322
From:
GB
Registered:
1/18/06
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Re: Question: Zones/Mpxio + Disk Array (HDS 9970V
Posted:
Aug 4, 2006 8:42 AM
in response to: frogman
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> Hello and thanks a lot for quick answers.
>
> By looking at your answer it looks like we are going
> to go for spare-root model.
>
> So, then to my second question which is actually
> something more of a design question i think...
>
> 1, I let's say i have my Main server running with a
> HBA card attached to a Disk Array (same as mentioned
> in my earlier question). I create and mount a nice
> disk 'pool' with ZFS and everything is working
> perfect.
create a zfs filesystem in the global zone for the zone. Something like
$ zfs create mypool/export/zones/zone1
$ mkdir -p /export/zones/zone1
$ zfs set mountpoint=/export/zones/zone1 mypool/export/zones/zone1
With zonecfg set your zonepath=/export/zones/zone1
>
> 2, I now create ZONE1. I would then like to mount a
> /export/home/ftp area on the Disk Array to use as
> well. Now, What is controlling my access to the HBA
> card and Disk Array from my Non-Global zone? How do i
> see my newly created /dev/dsk/... on the Array? Do i
> have to install the same driver into the non-global
> zone as i did to the Server itself or?
The easiest way is -
$ touch /reconfigure
$ init 6
After the reboot in theory you should see your new device. By memory, you should be able to use the luxadm command to see the failover paths. Are you able to do a reboot?? There are a few more commands you need if you can not. I am assuming the server is currently not production :)
You should mount /export/home/ftp on your global zone (using ZFS), and then define it as a mount point using zonecfg for each of your zones.
>
> I hope i have succeded in making some sense here
> since this is bugging me and my Manager a little now.
I will all look easy and logical once you have done it once.
Doug
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Christine Tran
Christine.Tran@Sun.COM
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Re: Re: Question: Zones/Mpxio + Disk Array (HDS 9970V
Posted:
Aug 4, 2006 10:33 AM
in response to: drdoug
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Doug Scott wrote On 08/04/06 11:42,:
> create a zfs filesystem in the global zone for the zone. Something like
>
> $ zfs create mypool/export/zones/zone1
> $ mkdir -p /export/zones/zone1
> $ zfs set mountpoint=/export/zones/zone1 mypool/export/zones/zone1
>
> With zonecfg set your zonepath=/export/zones/zone1
Wait a sec, this doc is pretty unequivocal about doing this:
http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/817-1592/6mhahuous?a=view
CT
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Posts:
322
From:
GB
Registered:
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Re: Re: Question: Zones/Mpxio + Disk Array (HDS 9970V
Posted:
Aug 4, 2006 1:23 PM
in response to: Christine Tran
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>
>
> Doug Scott wrote On 08/04/06 11:42,:
>
> > create a zfs filesystem in the global zone for the
> zone. Something like
> >
> > $ zfs create mypool/export/zones/zone1
> > $ mkdir -p /export/zones/zone1
> > $ zfs set mountpoint=/export/zones/zone1
> mypool/export/zones/zone1
> >
> > With zonecfg set your zonepath=/export/zones/zone1
>
> Wait a sec, this doc is pretty unequivocal about
> doing this:
> http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/817-1592/6mhahuous?a=
> view
Hmmm, I have been doing this for a long time (though on nevada) with no problems. If this document is correct it looks like Sun has shot itself in the foot and released ZFS to Solaris 10 with a zery large bug. Is UFS safe???
Doug
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Posts:
988
From:
US
Registered:
3/9/05
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Re: Re: Re: Question: Zones/Mpxio + Disk Array (HDS
9970V
Posted:
Aug 4, 2006 1:38 PM
in response to: drdoug
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> Hmmm, I have been doing this for a long time (though on nevada) with no
> problems. If this document is correct it looks like Sun has shot itself
> in the foot and released ZFS to Solaris 10 with a zery large bug. Is
> UFS safe???
There isn't a run-time issue but rather the issue is around *upgrading*
of such non-global zones. Currently, neither Live Upgrade nor
traditional upgrade (in Solaris 10 or Solaris Express) correct handle
zones with root file systems on ZFS. This will be fixed although I
don't know in which build/release of these products.
The work around today is to uninstall the zones on the system, then
perform the upgrade, and then reinstall the zones.
dsc
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506
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Re: Re: Re: Question: Zones/Mpxio + Disk Array (HDS
9970V
Posted:
Aug 4, 2006 1:39 PM
in response to: drdoug
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Doug Scott wrote:
>>
>> Doug Scott wrote On 08/04/06 11:42,:
>>
>>> create a zfs filesystem in the global zone for the
>> zone. Something like
>>> $ zfs create mypool/export/zones/zone1
>>> $ mkdir -p /export/zones/zone1
>>> $ zfs set mountpoint=/export/zones/zone1
>> mypool/export/zones/zone1
>>> With zonecfg set your zonepath=/export/zones/zone1
>> Wait a sec, this doc is pretty unequivocal about
>> doing this:
>> http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/817-1592/6mhahuous?a=
>> view
>
> Hmmm, I have been doing this for a long time (though on nevada) with no problems. If this document is correct it looks like Sun has shot itself in the foot and released ZFS to Solaris 10 with a zery large bug. Is UFS safe???
For some reason the url provided does not seem to bring up
any specific section in the doc for me, so I am not sure
which section is being referenced.
Although you can put a zone on a zfs filesystem, we currently
caution against this because the upgrade support
is not available yet. If you do this on S10u2, you won't be
able to upgrade to S10u3. There is also an issue with how
space is calculated for installing patches when the zone is
on zfs. We have this on the list of things to work on, but I
am not sure when it will finally be done. In the meantime, you
have to be careful about this kind of configuration. We do have
code already available in opensolaris which will automatically
create this kind of configuration. It has not yet be backported
to S10 because of the these issues though.
I am not sure what the comment about 'ufs not being safe' means.
Jerry
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Re: Re: Re: Question: Zones/Mpxio + Disk Array
(HDS 9970V
Posted:
Aug 4, 2006 1:44 PM
in response to: drdoug
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Doug Scott writes:
> > Wait a sec, this doc is pretty unequivocal about
> > doing this:
> > http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/817-1592/6mhahuous?a=
> > view
>
> Hmmm, I have been doing this for a long time (though on nevada) with
> no problems. If this document is correct it looks like Sun has shot
> itself in the foot and released ZFS to Solaris 10 with a zery large
> bug. Is UFS safe???
It's not quite a "bug." Instead, the issue is that ZFS and LU don't
get along, and LU support for ZFS might not be available at the time
that LU support for Zones is made available. We don't want anyone to
get in an "un-upgradeable" situation, even if temporary.
--
James Carlson, KISS Network <james dot d dot carlson at sun dot com>
Sun Microsystems / 1 Network Drive 71.232W Vox +1 781 442 2084
MS UBUR02-212 / Burlington MA 01803-2757 42.496N Fax +1 781 442 1677
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Posts:
322
From:
GB
Registered:
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Re: Question: Zones/Mpxio + Disk Array (HDS 9970V
Posted:
Aug 4, 2006 2:12 PM
in response to: frogman
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Pierre,
OK from the shotgun of replies :), we have worked out there maybe some ZFS/zones upgrade issues for Sol10. Does this stop you from doing what you want to do?
If you need to upgrade with the zones in place, then you might want to wait for a later Solaris release, or is the work around "uninstall zone, upgrade, reinstall zone" ok for you?
The other option would be to put your zones on UFS, and mount /export/home/ftp on ZFS.
Doug
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Posts:
412
From:
Registered:
6/16/05
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Re: Re: Question: Zones/Mpxio + Disk Array (HDS 9970V
Posted:
Aug 4, 2006 3:53 PM
in response to: frogman
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Pierre Klovsjo wrote:
> Hello and thanks a lot for quick answers.
>
> By looking at your answer it looks like we are going to go for spare-root
> model.
>
> So, then to my second question which is actually something more of a design
> question i think...
>
> 1, I let's say i have my Main server running with a HBA card attached to a Disk
> Array (same as mentioned in my earlier question). I create and mount a nice
> disk 'pool' with ZFS and everything is working perfect.
Given the aforementioned limitations regarding zones and ZFS: will Zones and
UFS/SVM work for you?
> 2, I now create ZONE1. I would then like to mount a /export/home/ftp area on
> the Disk Array to use as well. Now, What is controlling my access to the HBA
> card and Disk Array from my Non-Global zone? How do i see my newly created
> /dev/dsk/... on the Array? Do i have to install the same driver into the
> non-global zone as i did to the Server itself or?
I don't understand all of what you are trying to do yet, but here are some
guidelines and specific questions:
1) The Solaris kernel (including device drivers) controls access to the HBA,
regardless of the existence of zones.
2) In general, Traffic Manager (MPxIO) should be managed from the global zone. A
zone can be assigned individual access to a file system which is benefitting from
Traffic Manager. In that case, the zone benefits from TM without even knowing it
is there.
3) Does your application need direct device access, e.g. access to /dev/dsk/...?
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jeff VICTOR Sun Microsystems jeff.victor @ sun.com
OS Ambassador Sr. Technical Specialist
Solaris 10 Zones FAQ: http://www.opensolaris.org/os/community/zones/faq
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Posts:
27
From:
Paris, FRANCE
Registered:
8/2/06
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Re: Re: Question: Zones/Mpxio + Disk Array (HDS 9970V
Posted:
Aug 7, 2006 3:53 AM
in response to: jeffv
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Doug, Jeff and all the rest of you guys, Thanks a bunch for all the answers!!!
After your answers and a lot of reading this weekend i have some thoughts on where to start.
Since i need to 'create and export' a ZFS filesystem from a Disk Array, here's what i will try to do:
1, Make the file system [around 110Gb] [b](/export/home/ftp)[/b] for my ZONE1 (an Anon FTP Server) in the Global Zone.
2, [b]'Delegate Datasets to an Non-Global Zone'[/b] as described in the [b]'Containers'[/b] Guide. This way the file system area for the Anon FTP Server will be 'local'.
3, This goes for all of my '3' Zones that i will create. I would like to be able to mount any DISK POOL from the Array and to have the ability to [b]grow[/b] the filesystems during normal hours since we are hosting the better part of the world here.
One of my problems is to understand how the access to the Disk Array (HDS 9970V) is being handled by the Non-Global Zone i.e. 'Anon FTP Server' in regards to the Global Zone where HBA Support is part of the Solaris 10. Where is the Access and HBA support handled to the ZONE's ? Transparently ?
Regards,
Pierre
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Posts:
412
From:
Registered:
6/16/05
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Re: Re: Re: Question: Zones/Mpxio + Disk Array (HDS
9970V
Posted:
Aug 7, 2006 11:02 AM
in response to: frogman
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Pierre Klovsjo wrote:
> Doug, Jeff and all the rest of you guys, Thanks a bunch for all the answers!!!
>
> After your answers and a lot of reading this weekend i have some thoughts on
> where to start.
>
> Since i need to 'create and export' a ZFS filesystem from a Disk Array, here's
> what i will try to do: 1, Make the file system [around 110Gb]
> [b](/export/home/ftp)[/b] for my ZONE1 (an Anon FTP Server) in the Global Zone.
>
> 2, [b]'Delegate Datasets to an Non-Global Zone'[/b] as described in the
> [b]'Containers'[/b] Guide. This way the file system area for the Anon FTP
> Server will be 'local'.
Why do you want to use a delegated dataset instead of a filesystem?
It would be very simple to mount a global zone filesystem into the non-global zone
using a LOFS mount.
> 3, This goes for all of my '3' Zones that i will create. I would like to be
> able to mount any DISK POOL from the Array and to have the ability to
> [b]grow[/b] the filesystems during normal hours since we are hosting the better
> part of the world here.
Do you want to grow the filesystem while logged in to the global zone, or
non-global zone?
> One of my problems is to understand how the access to the Disk Array (HDS
> 9970V) is being handled by the Non-Global Zone i.e. 'Anon FTP Server' in
> regards to the Global Zone where HBA Support is part of the Solaris 10. Where
> is the Access and HBA support handled to the ZONE's ? Transparently ?
If you mount the filesystems in the global zone, and then use LOFS mounts into the
non-global zone, everything is handled transparently. The processes in the
non-global zone 'see' a normal filesystem.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jeff VICTOR Sun Microsystems jeff.victor @ sun.com
OS Ambassador Sr. Technical Specialist
Solaris 10 Zones FAQ: http://www.opensolaris.org/os/community/zones/faq
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
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